Holly
Mosher |
Kathleen
Slattery-Moschkau |
Holly Mosher and Kathleen Slattery-Moschkau
interview
by Sam Quo Vadis
I
recently had the opportunity to pose some questions to SIDE EFFECTS
producer Holly Mosher and writer/director Kathleen Slattery-Moschkau.
"Side Effects" is a critically acclaimed romance/comedy/drama
that presents a satirical take on the pharmaceutical industry. It
stars Katherine Heigl ("Roswell," "Grey's Anatomy")
and Lucian MacAfee ("Virginia Jack," "The Sleeper").
Sam:
Tell us a bit about yourselves and how you came to work together on
SIDE EFFECTS. (By "a bit" I mean go into great detail. {grin}
)
Kathleen: I grew up in a small town in northern Wisconsin.
I graduated from the university of Wisconsin with a degree in Political
Science (I also played racquetball for the University of Wisconsin
racquetball team). I always had a passion for film, but in my younger
years (high school and college), I was always too 'practical' to consider
it for a career. Maybe due to how I was raised or some other craziness,
I felt like I had to graduate from college in four years and go out
and get a 'real job'. Even though I loved film, it NEVER occurred
to me to pursue it as a career or to even to take classes in that
direction as an undergrad. My desire to be involved in film continued
to eat away at me as I entered the corporate world. By that time,
I was already locked into life in Wisconsin…a house, a husband,
etc. I became a closet screenwriter because I felt it was the one
way that I could be involved with film and live in Wisconsin. Although
I have no formal screenwriting experience, I read tons of scripts,
watched lots of films, attended weekend writing seminars, read lots
of screenwriting textbooks, and began to take acting classes to better
understand the use of dialogue, etc. I also had some great people
reviewing my work and giving feedback. Fast forward a few years to
Side Effects (which was not my first script). The first draft of SIDE
EFFECTS practically wrote itself…I was writing from the heart
and writing from experience and trying to be as honest in my writing
and my goals as possible…I wanted to write a real woman who was
facing an issue that affects almost all of us…that issue of what
we sell ourselves for everyday…that fork in the road of do I
pursue what I love and feel right about or sell out for the big house
in the burbs, the big SUV, the granite countertops, etc. I also felt
the backdrop of the script (the pharma industry and how they operate)
was critical for us as consumers and prescribers of prescription medications
to understand…it was a world most had not yet seen or had very
little understanding of. 63,000 drafts later (does the tweaking EVER
end?), we have the version of the script that appears on the screen.
I landed an agent in LA for Side Effects. However, he wanted me to
water down the script significantly to make it more appealing to the
studios. When I started seeing the results of what he felt would 'sell',
I said no thank you, I will make my own damn movie. (to be honest,
the choice was not just as easy as this. Living in Wisconsin, I knew
I would be cutting myself from my only Hollywood connection. In the
end though, I just felt that I could not sell out again. I lost sleep
and weight over this decision, but the moment the final decision was
made, it felt amazing )
I made the decision to make the film at the end of April 2004. I raised
the money within 30 days and we were shooting with Katherine Heigl
by July 19th. (less than three months from the moment I walked away
from my agent) To be honest, previous to this time, I NEVER thought/considered
making my own film. Once I made the decision, I was scared to death
but unbelievably invigorated by the liberating thought of just doing
it myself. That said, I still feel a little shell shocked by this
whole experience. It has been non stop for almost two years now. Every
day I wake up and have to do 20 things I never have done before…and
it is challenging, exciting, exhausting, scary, and intoxicating as
hell.
The day I decided to make the film, I immediately hired an entertainment
attorney who held my hand throughout the process of pre-production.
He had worked with Holly before and knew that this project would be
right up her alley. He knew she was looking for a project that was
meaningful…was saying something. I was fortunate because she
loved the script and came on board for much less money than she is
worth. She and I work very well together…we bring different qualities
to the table which complement each other. However, the two things
we do have in common have been critical to making this very low budget
project fly…work ethic and persistence. To be going at this pace
for two years requires both. I am so fortunate to have landed a producer
who cares so much about the project and has been willing to work night
and day to see it through. We are on the phone and e-mail with each
other constantly day in and day out and this has been critical to
taking SIDE EFFECTS this far.
Holly:
Kathleen had brought on the lawyer, Dan Kattman, I use, to help her
put her business plan together and to be her production consultant.
So after she had raised the funds for filming, he told her it was
time to bring on a producer to help run the show. I had used Dan for
the two previous films I had made in Wisconsin, and he knew that I
was looking for films with a positive political message, so he recommended
me. 10 pages into the script, I knew I'd like where it was going,
so I chatted with Kathleen to get a feel for her and what she wanted
for the project. Within two weeks I was on a flight back to Wisconsin
to shoot and within four, we were shooting! It was the fastest pre-production
I've ever been through, but Kathleen had a tight
deadline in her mind, so I didn't want to do anything to put a damper
on her enthusiasm.
I
have to say it's been an absolute dream to work with her. We have
been able to truly work as a creative team throughout the whole process.
I stayed on her couch in the basement during filming and some nights
we'd get home and go over film terms and ways she could choose to
shoot, so that she would know how to talk to the DP about what she
wanted. I think it has been an amazing balance of what each of us
is good at and also fully appreciating
the others' talents while forgiving our weaknesses.
Because
the symbiosis was so easy and comfortable, I think it made the choice
to self-distribute obvious. I have to say that her sales background
has also taught me a lot and led us to really continually think outside
the box with every effort we make in marketing our film.
Sam:
How did SIDE EFFECTS originate? What is it about?
Kathleen: Side Effects is a feature film loosely based on my decade
selling pills for the pharmaceutical industry. This experience provided
a lot of great material to work with…funny, shocking and soul
searching. The film is a satirical insider's look at the daily marketing
practices of the pharmaceutical industry. SIDE EFFECTS is fiction
and follows the ethical, comical, and disturbing experiences of a
young woman caught on the inside of an industry out of control. On
a basic human level, it is a film that evaluates what we sell ourselves
for each day. I think this is why the film is resonating with folks
so much…even those who don't give a lick about the pharma stuff.
Most of us at some point or another have faced these choices…a
life/career filled with passion and integrity vs. selling out for
money, benefits, and the charade of the good life.
Sam: What were the three greatest challenges you faced
in making SIDE EFFECTS?
Kathleen:
* Very little money.
* Very little time.
* Did I already say very little money????
Holly:
I'd say our biggest challenges were a lack of time - we really shot
in 15 1/2 days and of course the lack of money. There are always things
you'd love to do, but with such limited resources, I had to get used
to saying
"No, but I wish we could".
We
really could have used more time to get more locations, more actors,
more takes, more choices for editing. Some scenes we were really limited
with where to go in the editing.
Sam:You were able to make Side Effects for less than
$200,000, yet the production values are better than in
some films I've seen with five times the budget or
more. How were you able to stretch this budget andget
maximum value and production values for the dollar?
What advice can you give filmmakers who are making a
feature film on a very limited budget?
Holly: I believe we were able to make SE for such a
low budget yet maintain our production values because
we had a team of people who really believed in the
project and who were willing to do things as favors and
just to be a part of something that they believed in
so strongly. There is a saying that I believe in "when
you really believein something, the world will
conspire so that you can achieve your goal". I have to
say that on this film, none of us ever gave
upbelieving in the project or the message we are
telling. I think we areat a point in history where we
are seeing the effects of corporate greed, so it is a
time when these messages need to get out there as
awake up call to the people. I think because of that,
we were lucky enough to bring this project to fruition
at a point when its message needed to be heard and I
believe that is also why we have gotten so lucky with
Katherine's rising star and all the wonderful
media attention.
I would say that filmmakers need to learn how to ask
for favors with humility and sincerity. Every time
people do things for us, I have felt so grateful for
their efforts and I know that they sense that
we consider everyone who worked with us to be a part of
our giant team. Everywhere along the line, we have
seen people join the team to be a part of the message
of the film, and I think they have all felt
great contributing. On other projects when there has
been more money involved, I have to say that often it
feels more just like a job. Here you could feel the
heart and soul along the way.
Sam: Tell us about the casting process. What was it
like working with Katherine Heigl and Lucian MacAfee?
Kathleeen: When I made the decision to make the film, I set a very
tight deadline for myself to begin shooting. I set July 19th as my
shoot date come hell or high water…the topic was too timely to
drag out pre-production and I knew I would have the best chance of
landing a name talent for the lead if I shot in the summer. (those
involved in television would be off, etc). The clock was ticking and
did not want to hire a casting director until I had my funding in
place. Thus, in the first few weeks, I just picked up the phone and
started calling people's agents. I was lucky in that there was a good
amount of interest in the script and several agents asked me to send
it to them. Because of our time constraints, we had to give the actresses
very short turn around time for an answer. It was really fun to hear
the general excitement about the script.
When I had my funding in place (at the end of the first month), I
hired casting director Dorian Dunas to help cast the lead. Dorian
had previously cast Katherine on other projects. We were very fortunate
in that Katherine loved the script and was willing to take on this
little indie film. Things moved very quickly…we literally signed
her within a couple days of her reading the script.
Katherine was amazing to work with…she set a fun and relaxed
tone on set and delivered an outstanding performance…I was so
impressed with her ability to pull off both the physical comedy needed
as well as the dramatic elements of the film. I love how well SIDE
EFFECTS shows her outstanding range. She really was perfect for the
role.
Holly:
I thought Katherine and Lucian were a dream to work with because they
truly understood that we were a low budget film with big heart. We
didn't have talent trailers, so they often didn't have the privacy
to get into character or all the usual standards that come along with
a film production. We also didn't have catering, and were getting
a lot of donated meals. I know this was really unusual for Katherine,
but she was really gracious about this.
I
have to say that they were both really fun, warm people. And Katherine
has an amazing sense of humor. I was cracking up at all the stuff
she'd be saying or doing to entertain.
Sam: How did you find the funding for the film?
Kathleen: I raised the money within 30 days from individual outside
investors. I was fortunate in that the people I approached were very
excited about the script, the potential for the film, and my passion
for the project.
I think more filmmakers should consider this option…rather than
waiting around for someone else to give them the nod…give them
approval. If we TRULY want to make films…how we want, when we
want…let's go out and raise our own damn money.
Sam: What's the funniest thing that happened behind
the scenes?
Kathleen:The funniest? During 'the intimate scene'…we were shooting this
very tender, lovely, scene and Katherine and Lucian obviously had
to be 'in the groove' to pull this thing off in a believable and intimate
way. In spite of the fact that it was 2:30 in the morning and cold
as hell, they were REALLY doing a nice job with the scene…it
was very slow and sexy and the few of us on the set were holding our
breath because it was so amazing to watch their chemistry unfold.
JUST at the moment when Lucian is leaning in and their lips are about
to touch, a HUGE moth the size of a small plane flies up between their
lips and they both screamed. It was so damn funny. Nothing quite like
shooting a film in Wisconsin.
The scariest? Having to cut scenes on the fly because you realize
you are running out of time…you obviously ear mark some scenes
ahead of time as potentially expendable, but suddenly you are out
of earmarked scenes and in a matter of moments you need to consider
what NOT SHOOTING certain scenes will do to the film/story overall.
These types of decisions were excruciating, but necessary.
The most unexpected? How fun and easy Katherine was to work with on
set. Being so low budget, we obviously did not have many of the accommodations,
etc that she was accustomed to. She was rolled with everything we
threw her way.
Holly:
I'd say the most unexpected thing was getting 5 minutes on CNN and
a ¾ page article in USA TODAY after only having played at Cinequest.
The press have just loved this film!
Sam: What is the most valuable thing you learned from the process
of making this film?
Kathleen: Most valuable lesson learned? To take the bull by
the horns and do things yourself…realize that you do not need
to wait around for someone to give you permission to make the film,
bring the film to the media, bring the film to theaters, bring the
film to DVD, etc. We each have more power than we realize, but we
need to recognize that power and have the ovaries/balls to not just
do things business as usual.
I talk to a lot of writers/filmmakers who are frustrated...but many
of them are just sitting around waiting for someone else to do something
with their project. Many of these people expend an enormous amount
of time 'networking'…trying to get to the powers that be and
trying to get these powers to recognize them. If those same filmmakers
would take all of that time/energy spent networking and actually USING
it toward PERSONALLY moving their project forward…fundraising,
project planning, etc. MAKE IT HAPPEN, instead of waiting for it to
happen.
At every step of the way, I had people telling me that I 'couldn't'
do things…"you can't raise the money that fast", "there
is no way you can be shooting by July 19th", "there is no
way that you will land a name talent actress with your budget/timeframe",
"you shouldn't cross genres or include documentary components",
"you can't shoot this film in two weeks"…this is just
a SMALL sampling. Every time I heard this, I followed my instincts
rather than their advice. I actually used these comments as ammunition
to fuel my motivation…my persistence. Life is too darn full of
people saying "can't" and I think this is exactly what holds
a lot of writers/filmmakers back. Once they hear can't, they don't.
Step out of the box, out of business as usual, and just do it yourself.
(Also, one practical pointer, when fundraising, be sure to budget
money for PR and advertising. Don't rely on some distributor to pick
up your film (again, waiting for permission). Even if one does, it
could be your worst nightmare…you sign away the rights and then
they lose interest…or they don't pay you due to funky accounting…or
they completely miss the boat on who/how to market it…or the
re-edit it, change the artwork, etc and it becomes a mess.)
Holly:
I'd say that you really can take things into your own hands from start
to finish. I wouldn't always recommend spending so much time on the
film festival circuit if you have a film that may be viable for the
general public. A lot of filmmakers spend over a year just trying
to get attention at festivals and by the end of that year, they will
be too burned out by festivals to adequately pursue distribution.
Sam:
I understand you ran into some "challenges" with the MPAA.
Can you tell us about them?
Holly:
This has been interesting because the rulebook of the MPAA says that
you can't use any drugs in your advertising. And unfortunately this
applies to legal, prescription drugs as well. So they didn't approve
of our posters or our artwork, which is really difficult to figure
out what to do. We have a film about the pharmaceutical industry,
and our message is about questioning the safety of the drugs that
everyone puts into their bodies. So you'd think that we actually are
on the same side as the MPAA. I think they wanted to use our film
to make a case in order to change the rules to state illegal drugs.
But I'm not sure if that will happen or not.
Sam: What would you like the audience to come away with
after seeing this film?
Kathleen: I want them to come away both entertained and maybe knowing/understanding
something they didn't before. I really wanted to have the audience
have some fun and I wanted the theme of what we sell ourselves for
everyday to resonate with them…to maybe give them cause for pause
as they reflect on their own choices. From more of a 'message' basis,
I also wanted them to have a better idea of how the pharmaceutical
industry operates behind the scenes…I wanted to show them instead
of just tell them. We are bombarded 24/7 by very effective drug advertising
these days and I felt it was critical for folks to think twice before
they pop their next pill. In this aspect, this project has felt very
much like a David vs. Goliath venture…the industry spends BILLIONS
each year trying to get us to take their pills…our film is SO
SMALL and SO LOW BUDGET that we hope we can at least make a dent in
this issue. I thought a fun and compelling FICTION film would be the
best way to reach folks with this message. Some of my favorite films
are ones that entertain and educate me…I sincerely hope folks
get some of both with SIDE EFFECTS. (We did go on to make a documentary
on this topic as well.)
Holly:
I hope it makes them question the influence the advertisements for
medication (and for anything for that matter) have over them. I know
a lot of people go to their doctor's offices because they've seen
a drug advertised on television. A lot of doctors are then put between
a rock and a hard place if they don't think it is appropriate for
that patient. Advertisements are only legal in the US and New Zealand.
Sam:
Kathleen, how does the process of writing differ from directing?
Kathleen: I love both. However, the REALITIES of directing
(especially given our budget)…working fast and with very limited
resources is both challenging and exciting as hell. Writing is more
of an escape, while directing is dealing with both the creative component
and reality.
I also think the act of directing will cause me to be a better writer…a
more thoughtful writer. To some extent while writing, we should let
go of reality (not worrying too much how a director will pull off
a scene), but that said I now fully 'get' the other side of the equation…the
tools that the director and actors will need to bring the vision to
the screen.
Although it was completely new to me (I had never been on ANY sort
of set before), I felt completely at home on set. Directing allowed
me to use the interests/skills that I am best at…while also allowing
me to lean heavily on others for things that are not my strengths
(or my interests).
I definitely want to continue down both paths (writing/directing).
Producing is my least favorite aspect.
Sam: Holly, what advice would you give new filmmakers?
Holly:
I'd say that if you are passionate about a project, even if you have
no experience, you can see that a film can be made. Try to surround
yourself with good people who also believe in your project and share
your dream and
then treat them as team members whose opinions matter. Nobody likes
a hothead director who only wants things their way. The wonderful
thing about film is collaboration.
Sam: Kathleen, what was it like to direct your first
film and see your creation come to life?''
Kathleen: Pre-production was such a blur that there was no time to
be nervous…we were working at lightening speed. However, the
final days leading up to the shoot, I have to admit I was VERY nervous.
That said, the moment I stepped on to set I felt at home…it just
felt right.
I think it helped me immensely that I knew the material so well…not
only did I write it, but I had basically lived the story for ten years.
SIDE EFFECTS is NOT autobiographical but I KNEW the character and
the setting so well…I saw each scene of the film very clearly
in my head. (that said, the realities of our budget restrained that
vision to some extent…no time for a lot of coverage, etc…thus
I had to marry the vision of the scenes in my head with the reality
of our budget, time constraints, etc)
I spent a lot of time in pre-production storyboarding and creating
my shot list…this was critical in order to get the vision of
the scenes from my head to the head of my DP.
It was amazing to see it all come to life…as mentioned, Katherine
was perfect for the role and completely understood the character…that
comes shining through on the screen. Accepting/coming to terms with
the realities of the budget also allowed me to be proud of what we
were able to accomplish with so few resources. OBVIOUSLY we would
have loved more coverage, more takes, more angles, more EVERYTHING
in order to really achieve my initial vision when I was 'just the
writer'. What we may be lacking in various areas of production value,
etc has been make up for by the wonderful audience reactions to SIDE
EFFECTS. It has made me realize that many people appreciate/are interested
in the guts/heart of a film and not just polish.
Sam:
Do you have other projects in development?
Kathleen: I am currently writing two other scripts...one on marriage
which I just did some preliminary shooting for…I am really excited
about this and it is hard to put it on the backburner while we are
knee deep in the distribution of SIDE EFFECTS. I'm already casting
in my head…
Holly:
I am trying to produce a film that is based on a classic book. It
also happens to be one of Kathleen's favorite books, so we may well
end up distributing that one ourselves as well.
Sam: What lasting memory or memories will you be taking with
you from this project?
Kathleen:
· An amazing feeling of liberation…a contentment that
comes IN SPITE OF absolute risk and lack of money, security, etc.
· Body and mind numbing fatigue. (smile)
· Gratitude to everyone who believed in and worked on this
project. Gratitude for such wonderful audience reaction IN SPITE OF
the some of the low budget nature. (this type of gratitude is so hard
to describe in words…it fills up every cell of your body…it
is an amazing and humbling feeling).
Holly:
As hard as the whole process has been, I really have 98% great memories
from it.
Sam:Thank you for taking the time to give us these
insights into the creative process and a look behind the scenes at
SIDE EFFECTS.
Holly: Thank you, Sam!
Read more interviews.
Screenwriter,
Sam Quo Vadis is a multiple award-winning writer and the founder of
The Screenplayers, a cooperative organization of writers and filmmakers.
His 20 minute comedic short, BABYSITTERS, starring Taylor
Bright, was produced in Chicago. Currently, he is writing the pilot
script, series bible and business proposal for MIND LORDS, a sci-fi/mystery/thriller
series he has created that is based on real world events.
Past
accolades include being a winner in the Texas Film Institute (TFI)
and Telluride Indiefest screenwriting competitions, a CineStory finalist,
a top three American Zoetrope screenwriter (twice), and a semi-finalist
in the Don & Gee Nicholl Fellowships in Screenwriting, Moondance,
and American Accolades competitions.
His
web page is http://www.studiostar.ca
